We caught up with the brilliant and insightful Joshua Gabert a few weeks ago and have shared our conversation below.
Joshua, we’re thrilled to have you on our platform and we think there is so much folks can learn from you and your story. Something that matters deeply to us is living a life and leading a career filled with purpose and so let’s start by chatting about how you found your purpose.
It took me many years to pinpoint my purpose. I always found myself being envious of my friends and their success at being artists, and business owners that are being paid to be creative. Not only was I beginning to be jealous of their success, but I began to adopt their sense of purpose to be mine. I allowed myself to believe that I needed to be as successful as they were, but this only caused me to become depressed. Of course, Instagram didn’t help the situation. It wasn’t until I began to focus on my faith and allowing God to shape me that these ideas that I had fed myself were nothing but lies. It was only when I allowed God to change my perspective that I began to realize that I was trying to make their paths in lives mine.
Once I realized that I am uniquely made and my purpose may be similar to those I surround myself with, but is not exactly what I’m supposed to be doing in life. It’s only been recently, through study of scripture and really heave prayer, did I realize that I have God-given gifts that my friends do not and vice-versa. Once I accepted this idea, my purpose has become more and more clear. Just like my famous artist friends have a purpose that is specific to them, mine is to me. It’s crazy, but so freeing!
I’m a graffiti artist, but my art is not for everyone. Only a small handful of people love what I create and this is part of my purpose. I truly believe that human beings thrive on being appreciated, loved, and needed. Society has taken these needs and twisted them to meet a certain agenda–mostly to sell ads and to keep people so captivated in the virtual world that they don’t realize that the real world is speeding past them.
A part of my purpose in life is to create art that will impact somebody enough that they’ll stop and think about it. They’ll think about the process, even if they don’t have a clue about what the process is. It’s thought-provoking to them; especially when I’m in the process of painting a mural or some letters in a public spot. I enjoy people asking questions. I enjoy sharing processes, explaining the different spray caps and paint types, and overall answering questions for people who may never have such an opportunity like that again. God has given me the gift of gab and the ability to relate to almost everyone I encounter. From the average passersby to vandals to the beginner and to other artists who may be much more skilled than I am. I’ve begun the habit of praying that God will open an opportunity to be able to positively impact whomever I come in contact with that day and every day. To me, it doesn’t matter what a person’s faith or religious belief is, I’m not here to judge them. I’m here to show God’s love through my art and my actions–this is my purpose.
Since I’ve adopted this way of thinking and carrying myself in this manner, I can share my friends’ successes without comparing myself to them. I can move freely in this world without allowing the depression, anxiety, and darkness that manifests with comparison issues, imposter syndrome, and jealousy. I thank God for this daily because too many people live this way and because of it, they are missing their own sense of purpose–if they realize it or not.
If there is one thing I can say, it is “do not allow yourself to live this way because it only will hinder your purpose in this world!”
Great, so let’s take a few minutes and cover your story. What should folks know about you and what you do?
My name is Josh, but most people in the art world know me as “KASM” or “Kasm78.” I began writing graffiti around 1995 and painted my first wall in 1996, where I became obsessed with the culture and creating art with a spray can. I grew up in a small city that resides in the middle of the California valley called Modesto. Modesto had/has it’s own culture of graffiti, but I wanted to explore more of what the rest of the world had to offer as to different styles, letter structure, and mentalities. So I traveled outside my hometown to paint with other graffiti writers in different cities of California. Over the past 28 years, I’ve developed a style that is pretty much considered my own. It is best explained as a simpler letter structure mixed with European and New York flavors.
During the day, I operate a Radiology department, but I also have a Limited Liability Company based out of the Denver, Colorado area called “Urban Sellout.” Urban Sellout’s focus is mainly affordable graffiti-inspired streetwear, selective stickers, and some original artwork. Urban Sellout is a play on how society views graffiti. In the early 2000s, whenever I would mention graffiti art to people, most of the time they would cringe. Every time I called graffiti “urban art,” people were much more willing to listen and accept the art form. I always found this funny. It’s the same now, but people tend to use the term “street art” instead. “Street art” makes people feel safe and comfortable with discussing the illegal aspects of graffiti. So, when talking with people, I usually use the aforementioned terms to create a wider space for open dialogue. “Sellout” is a play on the idea that I have to do exactly that, use different language to create such a space for people, and, therefore, some graffiti writers believe that in doing so, I’m not being true to the graffiti culture. Also, Urban Sellout is a statement about how I’ve decided to walk the path that God has created for me. As diverse and beautiful as the world of graffiti is, there is a lot of darkness involved with it. The graffiti culture is often glamourized as exciting–and it is! But with a culture that is built on ego and emotion, there is a lot of drug abuse, alcohol abuse, depression, and anxiety that creates a world of self-destruction. I choose to be a positive force in this darkness and because I carry this mentality, it has allowed me a lot of positive interactions with a lot of amazing people–no matter our history, our difference in backgrounds, or our ideas on the politics of graffiti (yes, graffiti has its type of politics).
With Urban Sellout, I’m looking to shift from being a for-profit business to a Nonprofit. I’m thinking about doing this because I will start using the profits earned from sales to help offset costs for a men’s ministry that I and a couple of other guys will be starting. The idea is that all the curricula that we use will be free, or close to free so that men who are struggling financially will be able to attend without having to worry about the additional costs of books. I believe that financial burdens should not keep people from learning, growing, and getting to know the purpose that God has for them. As a Christian, I’m called to be the salt of the earth and a light in the darkness. With this in mind, I’m hoping to have some new artwork, new shirt and hoodie designs, and some other dope stuff available by the end of January 2024 available. So, more to come with Urban Sellout.
Looking back, what do you think were the three qualities, skills, or areas of knowledge that were most impactful in your journey? What advice do you have for folks who are early in their journey in terms of how they can best develop or improve on these?
In looking back, three qualities that have been most impactful in my journey have been: personal drive, adaptability, and being approachable. In most of the things that I have accomplished over the past 3 decades of painting graffiti, having an inherent drive has made me want to learn everything I could about graffiti. I began when the internet was still fresh. Social media didn’t exist and if a person wanted to learn something, they would have to dig in an read books. So I did! I read every book and watched every VHS tape I could find on the history and culture of graffiti. I also made it my goal to make my work stand out in a manner that made onlookers, especially other graffiti writers, know it was my work. In fact, for almost the last 5 years, I rarely sign my graffiti walls. Any paid murals get “Urban Sellout” put on them.
Adaptability is important in graffiti. Originally, a lot of graffiti writers came from middle to lower-class cultures. Being able to adapt was key to completing illegal work and “missions.” Being adaptive naturally crossed over when creating legal work. It’s amazing how creative and intelligent a lot of graffiti writers are. Place an obstacle in the way, and we’ll figure out several ways to get around, under, or over it–it’s a “get the job done” mentality that still is used today.
Lastly, I’ve always made myself approachable. In the past, most graffiti writers were stand-offish and kept their circles small. I’ve always been the opposite. This could be viewed as negative, but it has opened a lot of doors for me–especially invitations to paint in spots or locations that may otherwise be inaccessible. I don’t keep myself approachable for these reasons, but I’ve always wanted people to feel comfortable around me–even in uncomfortable situations.; of which there have been many. Approachability allows dialogue that may never have been able to take place otherwise. Plus, I think that being approachable makes me a better human being.
Some advice I can give is to be approachable and stay humble. No one likes an arrogant hothead or a know-it-all. If you know tricks to do something more easily, show people. When you die, you can’t take it with you. Lastly, focus on your craft! Be the best you can be at it and always find new ways to improve on it. If you’re an artist or creative or whatever, keep working at it!
What is the number one obstacle or challenge you are currently facing and what are you doing to try to resolve or overcome this challenge?
One of the greatest challenges that is faced in the graffiti/mural world is when getting paid for work. Whether it is a mural, digital work, or even clothing design. Oftentimes, people or companies tend to pay less when I refer to myself as a graffiti artist. There’s a common misconception that because I paint a lot for free, when a possible commission is presented, those people also think it should be close to free. This isn’t how it works. This is also why the terms “muralist” or “street artist” are often used. A street artist can, and usually will, get paid more for work than a graffiti artist. I’ve seen and heard it a hundred times.
For people hiring artists, keep this in mind: You aren’t paying specifically for the work that is going to get done, but you’re paying for the work that was put into getting that work done.”
In other words, one of the greatest challenges is to explain the value of someone paying me for art. So, in the past few years, I stopped seeking people to do work for. Now, I wait for people to seek me out. This way, they know what they are getting and it will be fair-priced. I do give away a lot of free stuff, but it’s not something that someone wanted me to do for them. It’s my work and I can give it away for free or charge a million bucks for it.
Contact Info:
- Website: www.etsy.com/shop/UrbanSellout
- Instagram: Kasm78 or urban_sellout
- Facebook: Kasm78
